Curse

romO · Nov 16, 2005, 06:11 PM // 18:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fantus

The current system WILL keep new players away from PvP since they can neither get into a group that can win nor can they win all by themselves.

listen, this happens to EVERYONE. you need to understand that. not just the low ranked players today. everyone had to get past the point and wait hours to get a single group that would get 1 fame if youre lucky. it took me 2 months to get to rank 3. but if you keep playing and keep getting better it will get much easier. it was easy to get to rank 9, but horrible getting to rank 3. you just need to suck it up and see the light at the end of the tunnel. this system will not prevent new players coming to tombs because they should just be doing what players have always had to do and suffer through that newbie period. i mean honestly, ill admit it, i sucked when i was a low rank. not that i was particularly bad with the buttons, but i had no experience, thought for myself instead of the team, and used terrible skill combinations. you have to accept that although you think you are not so bad as an unranked player, you really arent very good and dont stack up to the top players. the only way that you will get better is with lots and lots of experience.

tomcruisejr · Nov 16, 2005, 06:24 PM // 18:24

the rank system sets a particular winning build to a certain group of people. its the rank system that prevents new flow of ideas to the tombs.

people with higher rank who want to win the halls impose a prospective partymate to have certain skills that worked for them. the generic ones.

whenever im not in a guild group, i make sure that i plug myself to new people. ranked or unranked. usually, it's the unranked groups that give me new skill to throw to my usual skill set.

"oh, that guy is using that weird skill. hmm imma try that one."

rank system : elitist system that is harsh to new players and is preventing the flow of creativity inside the tombs. i've beat the harshness of it by gaining the wolf emote, but instead of it eating me up, i wish i can be a part of tearing it down.

Fantus · Nov 16, 2005, 07:03 PM // 19:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by romO

listen, this happens to EVERYONE. you need to understand that. not just the low ranked players today. everyone had to get past the point and wait hours to get a single group that would get 1 fame if youre lucky.

Not quite everyone since when GW started there were no ranked players (but yes, I don't question that it was hard for everyone).

@Rey Lentless: Don't worry, that I think the system is broken to a certain degree won't keep me from bashing my head against the rank wall long enough to get that deer emote one day.

Rey Lentless · Nov 16, 2005, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Quote:

oh, that guy is using that weird skill. hmm imma try that one

No, we've played long enough to identify crappy skills. You're confusing creativity with just not knowing any better. But go ahead.. Fight The Power!

Quote:

Not quite everyone since when GW started there were no ranked players (but yes, I don't question that it was hard for everyone).

Well, I didn't start tombing until a few months ago.. so I believe I was in the exact same spot that you're in right now.. and it's not that hard. While I imagine gaining fame may have been easier right as the game started because nobody was higher ranked.. there are advantages to starting out now. There was no faction initially (and then crappy faction for a while), and there were worse drops in the hall.

You can bang your head against a wall, or you can change what you're doing to help yourself.

RoF · Nov 16, 2005, 07:55 PM // 19:55

I made some suggestions earlier. I don't know if they were read, but oh well...

I'm in pretty much the same situation as you, Fantus. New to tombs (R1), and won't join a pvp guild because the guild I'm in is awesome and I want to be loyal.

But guess what? Just because your PUGs are low ranked doesn't mean they have to suck. No, you won't hold the halls, deal with it. But you can certainly form a PUG of unranked that reaches the halls provided that you do a few things.

This becomes your spam message:

(Your Class Here) LF organized group using TS only! I can play any build you need me to play! (List of popular builds goes here)

I gaurantee you that you will have an invite. If you want people to think you know what you're doing, then sound like you know what you're doing.

If you enter a group and find out that it was a random invite, they arn't using TS, and have no clue what they want you to do... then leave... this is a formula for a PUG that dies to the ghosts

CAT · Nov 16, 2005, 07:58 PM // 19:58

honestly, people just dont understand
im not gonna try to argue with noobs, but if anyone is actually trying ill just help them out

rank means everything, rank 2 players suck seriously. Ive never met a rank 2 player that knows what they were talking about. Yea, I thought i did when i was rank 2.

If getting into groups is so hard, then lead your own team. I made groups all the way till today and now im the leader of my guild and doing fine. I design builds and pwn gvg. If your going to sit there and complain about groups sucking then your not getting anyone to change. When you hit rank3, your gonna be in the r3+ groups. Your not going to join r2- because your better then that, and why be in a worse group if you have to?

If anyone wants to argue with me more im bored, char name in profile

Fantus · Nov 16, 2005, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

You can bang your head against a wall, or you can change what you're doing to help yourself.

Since changing guilds is the ONE thing I am definitely not going to do, what OTHER things are there I can change? Sounds to me that banging my head against that wall is the only real option within the given system, or I am I terribly wrong about that?

CAT · Nov 16, 2005, 08:18 PM // 20:18

lead your own groups

go get your own fame, dont expect rank3+ pugs(which are still horrible) to carry you

jules · Nov 16, 2005, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAT

rank means everything, rank 2 players suck seriously. Ive never met a rank 2 player that knows what they were talking about.

There are some exceptions. I have PUGed in tombs with some r1 players and we did quite well, even better than some of the r3 groups I've been in.

Leading a group in tombs is one of the things I hate doing most. It's just that I'm not any good with screening whispers + inviting + sorting out the build with team members all at the same time. One thing that makes a difference is a decent group leader who screens well, and makes sure that everyone in the group understands the build. Unfortunately with how tombs is these days forming a decent team that will actually stay together for a few runs takes quite a while, unless you're in a PvP guild, of course.

CAT · Nov 16, 2005, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by jules

There are some exceptions. I have PUGed in tombs with some r1 players and we did quite well, even better than some of the r3 groups I've been in.

Leading a group in tombs is one of the things I hate doing most. It's just that I'm not any good with screening whispers + inviting + sorting out the build with team members all at the same time. One thing that makes a difference is a decent group leader who screens well, and makes sure that everyone in the group understands the build. Unfortunately with how tombs is these days forming a decent team that will actually stay together for a few runs takes quite a while, unless you're in a PvP guild, of course.

I got all the way to r6 without a decent guild, making pugs is the way too go.

Basically your saying that your not good at organizing, you just want other people to organize things for you but also for them to be better then you are but still letting you in.

Rank 1 people are not good, honestly. People say they are, but I make tombs groups without checking /rank unless I think someone is a noob, at to this day ive NEVER had a person hit a crappy rank in my group. Go learn how to make guilds and find a friendly guild to talk to and give advice, get people and make sure all of their skillbars are exactly how you want them, carry them. Its the easiest way. Your not gonna win tombs just picking up people who you think would be good in the group. You need to have a plan(IE: 2 monk/mes healing, a monk/ele glyph prot, 2 axe warriors, air ele, shutdown mesmer, necro) and get people with the exact skillbars you need, make sure your build can handle relic runs and altars ect. If you cant organize a group then just go join groups and get 1 fame at a time. lol

Navaros · Nov 16, 2005, 08:56 PM // 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

There was no faction initially (and then crappy faction for a while), and there were worse drops in the hall.

Were worse drops in Halls? Halls still drops tons and tons of useless garbage. I have not yet read in an Update Logs where the devs even attempted to address this issue. If they have, can you please provide a link to the Update Log in which they have. I've love to see that.

Wasteland Squidget · Nov 16, 2005, 09:04 PM // 21:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

While I imagine gaining fame may have been easier right as the game started because nobody was higher ranked.

Incorrect.

When the game was released, one had to win two battles to gain 1 point of Fame (and gained one extra every battle thereafter - that is, the first successful match didn't count for the purposes of fame) and Burial Mounds was made up of 6 teams.

Getting Fame under those circumstances meant something because you had to be able to win Burial Mounds consistently, which meant having good players that could defeat 5 or 6 teams consecutively, and good anti-ganking strategy. IWAY as it is now would never have worked then as a means of Fame farming.

And in those days, Fame meant something towards the skill of the player - if I see a Rank 3 Healing Monk now I don't know if they're any better than a Rank 0, because they probably just gained their points running IWAY as something entirely different.

CAT · Nov 16, 2005, 09:05 PM // 21:05

Agreed, buriel mounds was a bitch

Rey Lentless · Nov 16, 2005, 09:24 PM // 21:24

Quote:

Were worse drops in Halls?

I may be wrong, but wasn't only ONE item dropped initially?

Quote:

When the game was released, one had to win two battles to gain 1 point of Fame (and gained one extra every battle thereafter - that is, the first successful match didn't count for the purposes of fame) and Burial Mounds was made up of 6 teams.

That's even worse then, the game's geared even more towards being friendly to the unranked people starting tombs.

Quote:

Since changing guilds is the ONE thing I am definitely not going to do

You're missing out on the best option available to you then, and no offense.. but that's your own self inflicted problem. Here are some of your options: develop a friend's list, form your own groups, unlock more things or UAS to make your tombs advertisement more appealing to teams looking, become friendly to a guild that tombs regularly but doesn't normally have a full guild group, read more guides on here so if/when you try to sell yourself to a higher ranked group you can at least sound like you know what you're talking about, stop posting on here expecting ANET to change something to make it even easier for you.

jules · Nov 16, 2005, 09:50 PM // 21:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAT

Basically your saying that your not good at organizing, you just want other people to organize things for you but also for them to be better then you are but still letting you in.

Wow you're making me sound incredibly selfish there. What I was trying to say was that I'm not a very good team leader. And that having a good team leader makes a difference. That's all

Santanus_Perro · Nov 16, 2005, 10:00 PM // 22:00

I announced I was building a team last night where build didn't matter, and you had to be below rank 3. I was with a team in seconds, and we had the full team in about 2-3 minutes. We did ok against the ghosts (+4) bonus., did ok in first round, but 2nd round took it hard to a very good iway team. Went again, same thing for ghost and first round, and then second round went up against one team, another iway, but did much better, still losing though. I have two more fame in about 30 minutes of fun. I will continue farming it, getting lucky to see some additional maps in Tombs until r3. Then I hope to have unlocked enough skills where I can play most builds.

PvEers who want to play PvP...it ain't hopeless y'all. Just grind it.

Divinus Stella · Nov 16, 2005, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Saying a rank2 person knows nothing is stupid, most rank6+ players are mainly just immature little kids anyway, the team leaders are the ones that know what they are talkin about, the rest just do what they are told, they dont have a higher knowledge of the game.

I knew the same when i was rank2 as i do now, i might be a bit faster with healing and have more skills unlocked but i still think the same.

Wasteland Squidget · Nov 16, 2005, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

I may be wrong, but wasn't only ONE item dropped initially?

I think they increased the number of Sigil drops from one to three a long time back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

That's even worse then, the game's geared even more towards being friendly to the unranked people starting tombs.

You'd think so, but it wasn't. Because Rank was so difficult to obtain, Rank elitism simply wasn't feasable for the majority of the playerbase. You couldn't go and run IWAY for a weekend, then flash your deer and get in good groups - you had to get in the good groups to begin with and work your way up as a skilled player rather than grinding for Fame. A Rank 6+ Group would take hours to fill, and Rank 9+ was outside of pretty much everyone's means (and I don't think the Rank 9 Emote was added until later.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

You're missing out on the best option available to you then, and no offense.. but that's your own self inflicted problem. Here are some of your options: develop a friend's list, form your own groups, unlock more things or UAS to make your tombs advertisement more appealing to teams looking, become friendly to a guild that tombs regularly but doesn't normally have a full guild group, read more guides on here so if/when you try to sell yourself to a higher ranked group you can at least sound like you know what you're talking about, stop posting on here expecting ANET to change something to make it even easier for you.

It's a bit harsh, but what Rey is saying here is pretty much true - Arenanet isn't likely to change anything regarding Rank in the near future, and while I don't particularly like the Rank system it's better to find ways to deal with it.

As far as guilds, bear in mind that you don't necessarily need to leave your friends to get in a good guild. Play Tombs for a bit and find some friends who run guilds of their own, then start discussing Mergers or Alliances to get a consistent Tombs team running. Once you're with the same team every night the other things will begin falling into place - beating IWAY, organizing your build, experimentation, and eventually taking the Hall. My guild went from a four-person-PvE guild to a guild with 30 active PvPers on in every day with those sorts of recruiting tactics. If it worked for me there isn't any reason it can't work for you.

tomcruisejr · Nov 16, 2005, 11:23 PM // 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wasteland Squidget

When the game was released, one had to win two battles to gain 1 point of Fame (and gained one extra every battle thereafter - that is, the first successful match didn't count for the purposes of fame) and Burial Mounds was made up of 6 teams.

yea. 6 team face off was the ultimate test. i miss those days.

when i went back to tombs, the 6 team face off was gone and there are no more rifts to kill

/cry.

Divine Elemental · Nov 16, 2005, 11:27 PM // 23:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAT

honestly, people just dont understand
im not gonna try to argue with noobs, but if anyone is actually trying ill just help them out

rank means everything, rank 2 players suck seriously. Ive never met a rank 2 player that knows what they were talking about. Yea, I thought i did when i was rank 2.

If getting into groups is so hard, then lead your own team. I made groups all the way till today and now im the leader of my guild and doing fine. I design builds and pwn gvg. If your going to sit there and complain about groups sucking then your not getting anyone to change. When you hit rank3, your gonna be in the r3+ groups. Your not going to join r2- because your better then that, and why be in a worse group if you have to?

If anyone wants to argue with me more im bored, char name in profile

lol i disagree with u this time Peps

ive found a few non ranked people and are now well known / got them their ranks
it just means u play tombs more than the other if u have skill
thats why i always take people who have been spamming for hours and u see them play bette rthan most of r6+
you only took people for ranks but i was not even ranked when u took me
i ask why? cause? Yea my point and ive grown you know and learned from what u did isnt it?